Neat!
Would make a nice pairing with:
which is sold by Lee Valley: https://www.leevalley.com/en-us/shop/home/toys-and-games/cra... (an excellent company to do business with).
A prototype of this was on Reddit/Imgur a while back:
https://old.reddit.com/r/DIY/comments/9en02z/kids_table_saw/
with instructions on making one w/ a parts list at:
Is anyone else bothered by hyperspecific products like this? 95% of what it does can also be done by scissors for 5% of the price and 10x the lifespan.
Cutting thick cardboard with scissors is a good way to hurt yourself.
You need some strength and a sharp blade to cut cardboard with scissors, for a child, it can mean going full force. And the more strength you use, the less control you have, increasing the chance of hurting yourself. That's also the reason why dull knives are considered dangerous. Scissors are for paper, not cardboard.
This tool looks much more controllable, which means it is safer, even before considering the intrinsic safety of the mechanism, more precise, and more fun to use.
Not at all bothered by this, this is very unique. Scissor skills are important but more so for paper which has limitations versus cardboard. I use a lot of power tools and my kid watches me kind of bored, unable to participate. I could easily see him feeling like we were 'working together' if I had one of these setup in my shop. He also likes to create all kinds of stuff and I'd be interested to see what he'd come up with.
But, what does bother me is the price, $250 seems steep.
The problem with this kind of thinking is that it doesn’t take into account how annoying other methods can be. Or how tools open up possibilities.
I can beat 10 egg whites by hand. I’ve done it several times. But it sucks. A handheld electric beater is fairly cheap and way better. You know what’s even better? A stand mixer that cost several hundred dollars.
Is it worth it? If you bake a lot it’s worth it.
This biggest problem with this kids toy is that it’s for kids and cost ~$250. It’s really an adult toy or something for the classroom.
If it was half the price, I’d pick one up, have bit of fun and on sell it or donate to other families.
I’m pretty sure a nibbler will not wear out anywhere as quickly as scissors.
It can allow young children to work independently so you’d have to factor in cost of supervision with the scissors.
Main problem with it is that it is more expensive than many real nibblers designed to cut steel, I guess for now that it is niche and designed for classroom use. Mass market it and I think it could easily come down to $50.
I like it from the standpoint of kids not being afraid of power tools. Plenty of adults would never do woodworking because the tools seem too scary. Teaching kids that power tools don't need to be scary as long as they're used safely is a worthwhile output on its own IMO.
It is not easy for children to cut cardboard with scissors. I'd say that remains true at least until age 10. Some younger may be able to manage a small amount of cutting but would get tired quickly.
I volunteer with scouts, kids aged 5-8. We ran a cardboard based activity with the makedo stuff. We tried to supplement with scissors, they were not effective.
Cutting cardboard in straight lines with scissors is easy, but cutting convex curves other shapes is really not, especially if you want to avoid bending it and collapsing the corrugation. Personally I use a knife, but obviously that isn't suitable for very young kids (not hugely safe for me either lol, I almost cut the end of my thumb off not too long ago...)
Not at all; you've missed the point. Everyone knows you can cut a box with scissors. The point is that you can't cut a board with scissors. This is a basic woodworking skill, and I think it's great if you can come up with a way to safely get kids accustomed to what those tools can do.
Agreed. It's like that old Russia-America joke. When they go to space they find out pens don't work because of gravity. Americans spend millions developing a pen which works without gravity while the Russians use a pencil.
I don't like Russians, but it's so stereotypically American to over-engineer a complicated alternative to scissors.
Maybe it's just me, but I'd rather teach how to use a knife safely? And a cut from a blade is a lesson to be learned, hopefully only once.
Edit: Oh and if anyone's looking for the tool name, it's called a nibbler. This one is just table-mounted, there are power tool and unpowered versions ofc.
You can introduce this way before you can trust a kid with a knife sharp enough to cut cardboard and they can use it way more independently.
> And a cut from a blade is a lesson to be learned, hopefully only once.
A cut from a simple blade (that can't chop your finger off) can be anything from easily healed to going through just the right part to limit the dexterity for life if you're unlucky. There's lots of time to learn using a sharp knife when they have great fine motor skills already.
"The nibblings are collected in a bin below, allowing you to recycle the waste."
In my area, this type of waste is not accepted in the recycling. Just like you can put paper in recycle, but you can't put shredded paper. This would work pretty well in the compost pile though.
Yeah, this is 100% wish-cycling -- and honestly, the total amount of shavings you'd be throwing away after using this device heavily wouldn't even amount to a single small cardboard box.
I’ve got one, my 3yr old loves it and uses it with supervision to make large pieces of cardboard into smaller pieces…
A warning, it’s a bit loud, definitely invest in kid’s hearing protection to wear when using it.
For 250 dollars I'd expect a motor you can barely hear, not one that needs hearing protection! And at least a partly alloy case.
Proxxon is a fairly pricy German mini-tool brand, has a far smaller addressable market (i.e. serious miniature hobbyists) and can still sell you a made-in-Europe MP 400 Micro Shaper, a mini router table, with 10 cutters, for about 200. The manual says it's 104dBA, but this video indicates it's actually fairly quiet in practice: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KpmzqvHqQM0
For $250, it was not worth it even before you told that.
My five year old played with this quite a bit at Maker Faire last year. He picked it up quite well. I had it in my mind to get him one for his next birthday but forgot until I saw this post. His school has Makedo tools and he likes them. So the combination might be something that he'd use on a semi-regular basis. We have no shortage of "material" being delivered.
Cool!
When I was a tyke I had a powertool set that worked on 1/8-inch balsa wood (not easy to find!). It was powered with a 12V radio battery, and Could Not cut fingers. There was a drill (spade bit, so it sucked), a circular saw, and another tool I have forgotten.
Pulled it out decades later for my niece to play with.
This, however, has more input material than 1/8th inch balsa. And thus, more outputs possible.
1/8" balsa was sold in hobby shops for making airplane wings and model rocket fins.
Looks a lot like my glass grinder. Nice idea but only cuts cardboard and $249 is crazy expensive.
This thing is so much fun. My friend's children have one. I was like, "Get the heck out of the way kid. This thing is mine now!"
It’s basically a tabletop router for cardboard. That’s super cool. The free motion in two dimensions is better than what kids usually get with toy saws and drills.
Routers are great tools but very powerful and finicky. This turns a router into a finger-safe jigsaw, which is a great idea.
It's not quite free motion in two dimensions. The mechanism is a nibbler, not a router. I.e. you can do 90 degree turns just fine, but you can't go sideways. You need to turn the cardboard to make a turn.
The article starts by dismissing scrollsaws as "pretty darn dangerous", but that's a pretty big stretch. They're less dangerous than a sharp kitchen knife. You want to talk to your kids and watch them closely the first couple of times they use it, but you'd be hard-pressed to find any accounts of serious injuries caused by scrollsaws.
This toy doesn't seem bad as a crafts tool that buys you several quiet weekends, but at $250... that's actually more than a miniature desktop scrollsaw (Proxxon 37088).
I don't have direct experience with a scroll saw but I own (well, made) a bandsaw and it's my favorite power tool. There's a lot you can do with it but more importantly, it's incredibly safe: The blade stays in one place and will never jump out at you or throw your workpiece into your abdomen. If you let your mind wander, you might end up with a cut on your finger. But that's about it. It's pretty much impossible to lose your finger to a bandsaw unless you have permanent nerve damage or are doing your woodworking on meth.
Yeah I thought it was really cool until I saw the price. Its a toy and costs more than most real tools. I cant help but think everything is a cash grab aimed at the rich nowdays. Maybe it really does cost that much but all I see is some plastic and a <$5 wholesale motor.
> less dangerous than a sharp kitchen knife
Which is less dangerous than a dull kitchen knife.
https://yakushiknives.com/blogs/yakushi-blog-all-thing-knive...
> watch them closely the first couple of times they use it
How about every time?
Everyone has dust collection in their wood shops now because wood dust is a Class 1 carcinogen.
>an oscillating cutter that's safely tucked beneath a puck-like protrusion
If it's an oscillation cutter it doesn't need to be that tiny, it can protrude just like a real band saw, it won't cut meat
This is very cool. The price point puts it beyond the toy category though. Maybe that will come down. Great idea.
250$ for anyone else wondering
For the price you could get five of these cardboard cutting tool kits. https://www.make.do/products/makedo-discover
If the only goal you have is cutting cardboard there are obviously more cost-effective ways to do that.
Can it do more than cardboard? Can it saw through plywood? Then it could replace the jigsaw.
This could be "bad, actually" if it gives an incorrect impression that power tools are unequivocally safe, rather than somewhat risky but usually safe when used correctly.
You're right, but one presumably would still teach kids to treat this tool with respect. And given that, it seems safer to me as this won't hurt them when they get careless (as kids are wont to do). That way you get a chance to reinforce the safety lesson before they graduate to the dangerous stuff.
I'm finding that a lot of parenting is teaching my kid that safety is something you have to do, and risks are something you have to look for and understand. For example, brushing your teeth is usually safe, but you shouldn't brush your teeth at a dead sprint down the stairs.
Not sure why you've been downvoted so heavily. That seems like a misuse of the downvote purpose.
But yes, I kind of agree with other commenters here in that maybe teaching absolute respect of a knife/table saw/power tool and its power to maim is a really important lesson that this sidesteps?
I help run a Makerspace, will definitely be looking into this. Great idea. I know many adults that should start out on such a tool!
If anyone in here buys it anyway, they could test if it works with leather, too. That would open up a lot of additional projects.
For similar price you can get a metal nibbler. Which is a handheld powertool designed for cutting metal sheets using a similar mechanism. They should definitely have more than enough power for leather although the cleanness of cuts will depend on sharpness and tolerance of blades. You might want to also look into electric shears.
I suspect you could probably work with pretty heavy leather, since the 3mm cardboard it's designed for is going to be pretty comparable to 5-6oz.The bed size might be too small for typical panel sizes though.
My wife bought one of these. First one arrived was dead on arrival, but the second works great!
I wanted this but the price seems way high.
By the way, could this concept be scaled up to cut wood?
> the price seems way high.
How much is your child's finger worth?
I'm looking at getting a SawStop table saw so I can teach my child woodworking with slightly more peace-of-mind that if something goes wrong, they'll be less likely to lose one or more fingers. Kids get distracted, they forget what rules you've taught them in the past, accidents happen.
This is also a tool I'll consider purchasing to provide my child an introduction to the concepts before graduating to the bigger, louder, stronger wood saws.
a pair of scissors costs $10
> The nibblings are collected in a bin below, allowing ...
...the child to spread them all around the house!
Got one of these yesterday that was on sale for prime day. They are super fun!
How much sale?
I was a little worried in the video by the kid wearing a sleeve. Seems like that could get sucked up into the mechanism pretty quick.
Yeah, if they're going to market this as kid-safe, they need to have videos of what happens when child-size fingers are intentionally fed into the machine, when hair is intentionally fed into the machine, etc.
Almost by definition, you cannot presume (as a product designer) that children will be capable of thinking of their own safety; which is not the same as a parent who knows their child, making the decision to expose their child to developmentally-appropriate risk
I'm a pretty OK machinist, but not a professional. My reaction is to think about long / loose hair, long sleeves and loose clothing, and (unlikely for kids) neckties. Those would be of concern for any open blade cutting machine, grinder, etc.
How? It's oscillating, not spinning.
Like a cast saw or an electric toothbrush.
Will an oscillating cutter suck up much of anything?
In the product video they address this concern, and literally show kids covering it with their hair while it's on, and say it's safe
A small oscillating scroll saw is pretty safe for kids, I used one a lot when I was a kid. Of course it's not impossible to hurt yourself with one, but losing a finger is quite unlikely. Very different animal than a handheld jigsaw, those still spook me (and aren't very good anyway, IMHO)
I want one!
My kids just take paring knives from the kitchen when they want to cut cardboard. More dangerous, but cheaper. Though they've probably destroyed $250 of knives... Hmm.
If it's for cutting cardboard, why not just use a pair of scissors?
Have you tried using scissors to cut corrugated cardboard? Especially trying to cut curves? The difficulty seems self-evident.
For straight lines you need something like a box cutter -- with scissors it will neither be easy nor particularly straight. While for even medium-sized curves or smaller details you really do need something like this.
uh? We used to have a jig or scroll saw when we were kids, it could cut thin plywood, but you could put your finger on the blade when it was working and it wouldn't hurt at all.
The scroll saw seems like about the safest power saw that a kid could use. But every one I've ever owned/used could definitely cut human flesh. Maybe someone could come up with one that has a very limited range of motion, so that it works like a cast saw / oscillatory multi-tool, where the teeth movement is so small that it is within the elastic range of your skin.
Yes—startling, but not catastrophic. I first used something like that at age 6. It probably COULD cut flesh if you really tried, but it would take some determination, and just the specter of damage was enough to keep me on good behavior.
I remember it as helping me develop a healthy respect for tools, and also to relate to the material world as something I can manipulate rather than something to be passively consumed. And to manage risks, and confront my fears.
My kids (8, 10, 12) have all used my scrollsaw with supervision without issue. Jigsaw is a bit more sketchy and reminds me of most the injuries I've seen in the shop around handheld router after the cut is complete. My lathe is the kids favorite tool to be honest.
Scroll saws operate at 400-1800 strokes per minute with metal teeth that can absolutely cause serious injury - please don't test this safety assumption with children.
Unlike the woodburning tool...
I have the makedo and the screws are legit amazing. I never imagined that they could possibly work so well. It's one of those things I always recommend to other parents.
The very real downside is that your kids become attached to their creations. So you end up with a house perpetually full of cardboard and fighting a constant battle to part with some of it.
I like the little tools, and actually the price for them isn't so bad (8 pounds, but if on a budget, that kind of saw is on AliExpress for 1 euro).
The price for the little plastic screws seems a bit nuts though (40p/unit), but I understand it's a razors-and-blades sales model. When I was in primary school, we used those brass split pin fasteners (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brass_fastener) for the same thing. You can even buy metal two-piece "mother and child" rivets 1/4 that price: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/316963279193, but they need a punch and driving it with a nice safe plectrum-style tool is maybe a little fiddlier. Blunt-ended plastic drywall screw-in fittings are also very similar and run about 5-10p each in boxes of 100.
There seems like a limited age range where a "Scru" is OK but a split pin is not (I know I used them at school almost immediately, and I started at the age of 4). The scrus get tighter, I suppose.
Thanks for introducing me to this. I hadn't previously considered there was a range of tools for kids to work with cardboard. It makes perfect sense.
I'm excited to try some of these with my kid. Paired with the Microbit and bag of various motors, LEDs and sensors, she can really start expanding her projects and imagination. I love it.
that looks awesome. thanks for the link