I tell anyone upset with this notion to start calling groups of people "gals", see how they react, and reflect on why it's different. Most people refuse to take that task seriously, which is a similar revelation.
I just always found it interesting that that was the hill that all of the moderation staff chose to die on and the channels would spend 95% of their time discussing/enforcing that instead of furthering the interests of Ruby.
Also in parallel, the "community" has fractured. Anyone working on the language is focused on the Japanese community, performance and what's going on in embedded.
The "community" is online policing everyones speech and generally making everything toxic.
Primarily I'm a Rubyist but I haven't engaged with any events or group discussion in the space in more than a decade and most other working Rubyists I know (aside from what's going on in Japan) are the same.
Well, given the number of times I've seen new community participants accidentally stumble into this rule unaware and get instabanned, the warning is necessary.
I didn't raise a huge stink with my comment. I just said "don't say it". I didn't give opinion or context, that was all inferred by the responses to it. I did exactly what the rule says, in fact.
It's not a non-stance. You say instabanning is extreme "if it's happening".
I pointed out the rule without any additional color and the response was kneejerk negative. This practically proves my point that people need to know about the rule and that people who stumble into it are getting punished.
It's just crazy to have rules that can't even be acknowledged without pillory. Anybody would be reasonable to see this and stay as far away from this community as possible.
there's a dynamic where over-attention to a rule, mentioning it publicly at every opportunity for example, is viewed as an intentional irritant meant to antagonize rather than any sort of constructive criticism
perhaps you can contact the people in charge of the rule directly, express that over-policing something like this could lead to backlash that overshadows the goal of the rule... and instead suggest a lighter touch like modeling their own language with the same ideal in mind, and advocating for a warning system rather than instabanning
This isn't the Ruby community. This isn't a place where that rule exists. We're talking about a thread advising people on how to get involved. Absolutely one of the first things that newcomers should hear about are community rules.
Apologies, it seemed I misunderstood this conversation.
I now understand that you were merely helping newcomers to ruby and were sharing the rule in an informative manner and you don't actually have an opinion about it worth sharing one way or the other!
Well, one of them has long established use as a gender-neutral term. At least in some dialects/accents of English. Just like using they as a singular was also well established.
I mean I get it, the rules of English often do not make sense, but our words can have different meanings based on context. Pretending like you don't understand that is nonsense.
But this is also not the right time to bring it up.
"that's the way it is" has also been used to oppress people countless times in the past, it seems foolish to not consider these things in a modern society that has plenty of space for it
language isn't a force thrust upon us, it's ours to shape
Guy: person —used in plural to refer to the members of a group regardless of sex
I tell anyone upset with this notion to start calling groups of people "gals", see how they react, and reflect on why it's different. Most people refuse to take that task seriously, which is a similar revelation.
I just always found it interesting that that was the hill that all of the moderation staff chose to die on and the channels would spend 95% of their time discussing/enforcing that instead of furthering the interests of Ruby.
Also in parallel, the "community" has fractured. Anyone working on the language is focused on the Japanese community, performance and what's going on in embedded. The "community" is online policing everyones speech and generally making everything toxic.
Primarily I'm a Rubyist but I haven't engaged with any events or group discussion in the space in more than a decade and most other working Rubyists I know (aside from what's going on in Japan) are the same.
I find the backlash more telling than the rule to be honest, it's not really the subject of this guide and yet it was the first comment
maybe it's a weird hill to die on, but it might be weirder that people see this hill and choose to go out of their way to charge up it
though I guess we can't help ourselves, plenty of people willingly travel to foreign countries only to balk at their rules and tastes...
Well, given the number of times I've seen new community participants accidentally stumble into this rule unaware and get instabanned, the warning is necessary.
I didn't raise a huge stink with my comment. I just said "don't say it". I didn't give opinion or context, that was all inferred by the responses to it. I did exactly what the rule says, in fact.
instabanning does indeed seem extreme if it's happening
> I didn't give opinion or context, that was all inferred by the responses to it
ehhhh, this sort of non-stance "I was just" anything tends to be very off-putting
It's not a non-stance. You say instabanning is extreme "if it's happening".
I pointed out the rule without any additional color and the response was kneejerk negative. This practically proves my point that people need to know about the rule and that people who stumble into it are getting punished.
It's just crazy to have rules that can't even be acknowledged without pillory. Anybody would be reasonable to see this and stay as far away from this community as possible.
there's a dynamic where over-attention to a rule, mentioning it publicly at every opportunity for example, is viewed as an intentional irritant meant to antagonize rather than any sort of constructive criticism
perhaps you can contact the people in charge of the rule directly, express that over-policing something like this could lead to backlash that overshadows the goal of the rule... and instead suggest a lighter touch like modeling their own language with the same ideal in mind, and advocating for a warning system rather than instabanning
Over-attention?
This isn't the Ruby community. This isn't a place where that rule exists. We're talking about a thread advising people on how to get involved. Absolutely one of the first things that newcomers should hear about are community rules.
Apologies, it seemed I misunderstood this conversation.
I now understand that you were merely helping newcomers to ruby and were sharing the rule in an informative manner and you don't actually have an opinion about it worth sharing one way or the other!
Well, one of them has long established use as a gender-neutral term. At least in some dialects/accents of English. Just like using they as a singular was also well established.
I mean I get it, the rules of English often do not make sense, but our words can have different meanings based on context. Pretending like you don't understand that is nonsense.
But this is also not the right time to bring it up.
"that's the way it is" has also been used to oppress people countless times in the past, it seems foolish to not consider these things in a modern society that has plenty of space for it
language isn't a force thrust upon us, it's ours to shape